It looks like the roman catholic church are bringing back the indulgence according to the New York Times.
Justin Taylor deals with this well when he writes:
"When it's all said and done, the whole idea of indulgences comes down to the idea that Christians must undergo a process of temporal punishment before they are allowed to go to heaven. But Scripture doesn't teach that. Rather, the punishment process was completely absorbed for us by Christ on the cross. We may receive discipline from our Father, but we will never again receive any form of punishment. Scripture no where hints that those who are united to Christ are in two categories and locations: those undergoing purificatory punishment in Purgatory and those in their heavenly home. All who die in Christ go to be with the Lord. Thanks be to God who clothes us with his righteousness and took all of our punishment."
HT:Justin Taylor
Wednesday, 11 February 2009
About Boaly
Gary has been involved in printing the Scriptures for 20 years, enjoys photography and rambling online
4 comments:
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Actually, indulgences have been there all along. The headline in the NYT story is grossly inaccurate; indulgences have nothing to do with absolution.
Justin is not too far off when he says that we receive discipline rather than punishment. Purgatory is actually neither, but it's closer to discipline. Rather, it's like stopping to wash up before entering a house. However much God may sanctify us in this life, we're still going to die with some faults that must be removed before we enter heaven. The more we conform ourselves to the Lord here, the less He'll have to remedy at the gates.
Indulgences are sort of like markers to indicate to us that we're doing something that will increase our holiness in this life. Reading your Bible daily gains an indulgence. So do certain regimens of prayer or fasting. The more we do those things, the more we are transformed into the eternal creatures God intends us to be.
Justin is also right that "All who die in Christ go to be with the Lord." Purgatory is merely part of the route.
Does that make sense? -
9:40 pm
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Hey, Joel, thanks for that explaination. I see what your saying, good to hear from someone who can tell us about it.
I understand where you're (the Catholic church) is coming from, but I think it's a failure to see that it is Christ's righteousness that covers all of our sins, not our righteousness.
I agree that:
"However much God may sanctify us in this life, we're still going to die with some faults that must be removed before we enter heaven."
But our entrance to heaven isn't depending upon our sanctification, rather on the finished work of Christ, which not only enabled us to be sanctified but declares us righteous before the Father.
The great exchange: Jesus took the beating for our sin (our punishment), and we get His righteousness imputed to our account. And the moment we die we will be perfected by His Spirit, in an instant!
You've probably heard this all before, so I'll stop now!
Cheers again for explaining the indulgences, interesting that we can have a tainted understanding of them. However on this one having it explained hasn't brought me to believe its biblical. Sorry.
I don't wish to offend you or slag off your beliefs here, just trusting that you take it as discussion.
(So many would probably jump to raised voices, adrenaline pumping, anger etc over either of our statements, but that serves no purpose. 'If you believe you have the truth, you've got to tell me, and if I believe I have the truth i've got to tell you'). -
10:56 pm
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I don't wish to offend you or slag off your beliefs here, just trusting that you take it as discussion.
Not at all. I appreciate that you take my comments as they're meant. Indulgences are one of those hot-button things that seldom get explained very well.
I have to agree with you that indulgences aren't supported by scripture as such, although there are a couple of allusions to something that might be purgatory. The passages aren't very specific. But indulgences aren't a very integral part of Catholic theology anyway. I don't think anyone's required to believe in them.
I don't get into indulgences much myself. It's my Protestant upbringing. I can explain them objectively, but it still feels like trying to earn God's favor. So, I tend not to keep track. -
2:24 am
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They mustn't be integral, my wife was brought up catholic & didn't have a clue what they were.
She looked at me and asked "What?"
it's something that has struck me funny even within the protestant church, that many aren't taught & don't have a clue as to the doctrines & teachings of their church.
When i first became a Christian i began questioning alot of things about the church i'd been brought up, i had been there almost 18 years & didn't really have a notion what they believed. -
8:09 am
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